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John Mitchell's (mostly DotNetNuke) Blog - Thanks for the ride DotNetNuke!
 Friday, January 05, 2007

Well it's been one roller coaster of a week.  Made MVP to start the week, and now after 2 years, 6 months, and 5 days on the Core Team, over 2,000 posts in the DotNetNuke Forum on Asp.Net, and over 2000 posts on the forums at DotNetNuke.com , I regret to inform everyone that I have been asked to resign. 

I'm still pretty shocked, especially since I was asked to deceive the very community that I have enjoyed being a part of all this time.

I won't go into any details or speculation as to why this happened. But I do want to make it public, no matter what the consequences are.  I'm guessing I won't be allowed back in the forums on DotNetNuke.com, but I'll be close by if you ever have a question, or if you just want to shoot the breeze.

The next time you are reading a blog and someone uses the word transparency, you may want to give the following e-mail some thought.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Greetings John ~

 

The purpose of this note is to follow-up on the email sent Tuesday, January 2 regarding DotNetNuke team organizational changes for 2007.  That email is attached below for your convenience.  This communication should be considered confidential and we would appreciate your cooperation in maintaining this confidentiality until our reorganization efforts are complete.

 

As the DotNetNuke project has grown and matured, the necessity to operate with increased stability and professionalism has grown as well.  Our project efforts this year, beginning in this reorganization process, will continue to emphasize this maturity.  While a change from previous years (some may remember the very ad-hoc way in which the original core team was formed), it should come as no surprise that our “selection criteria" and team expectations continue to mature as well.

 

Although we will increasingly seek additional ways to both accept and recognize community contribution, Core Team membership cannot be treated as a token of "reward".  We must distinguish between contributions which require privileged access to resources and channels from those that do not.  Additionally we must distinguish between periodic contributions and commitment to regular, ongoing responsibility according to the needs of the project.  It is the needs of the project that dictate these roles / responsibilities.

 


The DotNetNuke team is asking for your voluntary cooperation, resigning your core team role for 2007.
 
John ~ We realize that this may come as a bit of a surprise.  However, after great deliberation on our part... we are unable to identify a suitable role of regular commitment that we can ask you to fill.  We hope that you will understand that this in no way means that we are unappreciative of your contribution or participation.  We expect fully that when we start publishing some community statistics you will be at or near the top of the list.  While we apply great value to this, it does not require Core Team membership to fulfill.  It is our preference that your resignation appear one of personal choice, which would be understandable given the level of responsibility you have in other efforts and your own business.  It's not like you're "leaving", merely making choices about regular commitments as we all must do, and we would like to be able to publicly support you in this way.  We wish you great success in your personal endeavors in 2007.

 

We appreciate your participation in the community and hope to see that continue.  As indicated, this year will see us looking for new ways to recognize those that are not serving in core team roles, yet participate in ways that provide other value to the general community.  Team members retiring voluntarily and "gracefully" can also expect the following:

 

~ Public support & appreciation for past contribution as you focus your energies on other endeavors (a past contributors page on www.dotnetnuke.com is forthcoming)

~ Continuation of some benefactor benefits for 2007 (eg. the resource listings and footer ads on www.dotnetnuke.com)

~ Retention of historical blog posts (though the blog roll will no longer carry your name)

~ Retention of moderator status for general forums

 

For the sake of clarity, our expectations of retiring "gracefully" are simply for you to indicate that you are choosing to retire and devote your energies on other endeavors (and to maintain this position in all public forums).  This will be easy for others to understand and support and helps us all to continue to work together harmoniously in a community we all wish to see growing.  Many of our retiring team members have business interests which involve DotNetNuke and we have no desire to adversely affect those in any way.  We will post personal notes of farewell and thanks via forums & blogs to support your public decision.

 

Kind Regards,

[name removed], and the management of DotNetNuke

1/5/2007 1:13:24 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)  #    Comments [18]
1/6/2007 1:34:57 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I only found your blog recently and it has helped me greatly in my very new development (both work and personal sites) of dnn. I am not only shocked but sorely disappointed in this news. Please, for the sake of folks like me (who recently added your feed to netvibes), keep the archives up.
Also, I'm not getting rid of your feed, I'm very interested in keeping in touch and learning what new paths you will forge.
Good luck with everything and thank you for all of the much needed support your blog has been to me and everyone else in the world!
1/6/2007 8:08:59 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Thanks for the uplifting words Monica.
I'm not going anywhere.
I find it very satisfying to share ideas, collaborate, and learn from my peers.
1/6/2007 8:18:47 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John -

Wow. That's completely unprofessional on their part. As much as it sucks, I could potentially be made to understand them asking you to step down just for reorganizational reasons. Things change at organizations, and people come and go, so that wouldn't have been so weird.

However, for an organization -- especially a commuity-focused organization like DNN -- to ask you to resign and then tell you that it needs to look like it was your idea is wrong.

I'm sorry this happened to you. People will notice this, though.

Let me know if you want to grab lunch sometime.


Scott Isaacs
President, WI .NET Users Group -- www.wi-ineta.org
1/6/2007 7:27:14 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Hi John,

I think this is a great blow for DotNetNuke, as I have seen you contribute so much to DNN in the past.

Good luck and thanks for the all the work thus far!

Thanks
Rodney Joyce
http://www.smart-thinker.com
1/9/2007 6:26:23 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I've only just started using DNN and the first post I found on Google was a real help.

This dismissal is clearly the workings of a Vogon. To fire you and suggest you act as if it was your idea and had resigned is childish and lacks moral fiber. I'll be back for more of your DNN experience and lore.

Thanks!

Michael
Michael Appelmans
1/9/2007 9:03:26 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)

Thanks Rodney, Scott, and Michael.

This has really been an eye opener. Not that I am inexperienced in these matters, but it sure makes you wonder if they really thought about what they were suggesting by putting themselves in my shoes. I mean, how could I possibly take them up on this great offer? Do they really think I'm a person that would trade that sweet deal for my integrity?

I have spent the last few days trying real hard to understand why they would take this approach instead of just communicating with me about what I might be doing that would make them feel uneasy about my participation in the "secret" meetings and private forums on this Open Source project.

I'm not going to dwell on it though. I'm a forward looking kind of guy.
1/10/2007 8:42:59 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Hi John,

I sympathise greatly, because no matter how it is put, it still comes across as a form of rejection... and that will be hard to swallow.

I've read the announcements about this and whilst I think the change is perfectly valid and appropriate for DNN's move to a profit-generating business model (Anyone who thinks DNN is a volunteer effort at the core-level needs to read between the lines of the introduction in the book), it has been managed in the same way they manage all their communications - badly.

Microsoft set the standard with the MVP system and you were justly awarded this recognition. It would have been a no-brainer for DNN to devise and implement a comparable DNNVP category for those contributors who no longer quite fit the new cor(e)porate membership criteria. Even if this were only temporary, the outcome would have been to maintain the relationships with everyone affected. The cascading benefit for the DNNVP's would be that they aren't faced with explaining why they lost their badge.

In any case, thanks for posting the email here for public consumption.

Regards,
Rob
Rob
1/13/2007 6:18:00 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John
Thank you so much for all your efforts until now.
I don't know what kind of political stuff's behind this but the "organization" took the risk of loosing one of it's most responsive and communicative members.
I don't know if I could stay as active as you have been lately after the something like this....
Thanks again
1/19/2007 9:34:32 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John,

I am very sorry to learn of this happening. You were one of the most helpful and visibly active members in the community. You will be sorely missed.
1/19/2007 2:19:11 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
This really makes me wonder if DNN is the "right" product for my interests. This year DNN has really evolved into more of a commercial entity then a open source project.
1/19/2007 10:50:21 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John
As a long time DNNer (June '02 back in IBuySpy days!!)it is really a shock to read that letter. I fully understand DNN moving to keep the core team fresh and relevant but as Rob says the MVP type system seems to work elsewhere and its patently obvious that you are very active in the community. The 'deception' slant is just misguided on their behalf and you are right to highlight it.

Is it just me or did something go awry with the whole DNN community when we moved the forums from ASP.NET?

Anyways I'm very pleased that you intend to stay active as I for one use many of your valuable tips 'n tricks.

Looking forward to lots more javascript, css and speeding up of DNN!
1/24/2007 6:03:07 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
All these comments so far seem to be all far too positive and nice to DNN inc.

John - I've only been using DNN for 3 months, but I've already found several of your posts and they've really helped. Thanks.

All I can say is that this email from DNN sucks - their behaviour is just plain simple wrong.

Good luck with whatever you move on to - I suspect you will move on after being treated this way!

2/7/2007 6:44:55 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Wow... sorry to see this event take place. I am a DNN newbie but I have found you contributions very helpful so far. Thank you John.
Frank
2/12/2007 11:23:35 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John,
I'm sorry to here that the DNN team made such a stupid decision. It's obvious that they are trying to attract some form of VC and are looking to have a minimal "core" team in order to do so (while relying on the free contributions of the community to keep their product fresh). What they should have done was to create a position on their core team for you. Without the community, DNN is nothing so why burn bridges with one of their biggest community leaders? Hell your blog was ranked one for the DNN related search that I did.

The smarter thing to do would have been to make you the community manager. That's as core to DNN as any programming task. Instead, they pull this ill-advised stunt. The stupid things that greed will make you do.
2/25/2007 2:21:42 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John,

I’m very disappointed and upset with the DNN core team.

Truth and integrity are such a rare commodities these days even though there is no justification for their absence. I fully support your disclosure of this email. Organizational changes are one thing but asking you to lie is the same as doing it themselves: they have lost my trust.

This saddens me as I’m fairly well invested in DNN now so the cost of a reprisal would be very high. A loss of community support for the project as a whole would be similarly costly.

Ends *do not* justify means so I don’t care if it was Tim Berners-Lee that wrote the letter – I demand an apology to you and the community!

Sincerely,
Lance
3/7/2007 9:20:04 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
John,
This prove to me that there are sides in the open source land that are dark. Nobody wants to talk about it, so it will not hurt the open source movement.
Open source is a cause and for the good of the it you are asked to lie:
- Lie, "This will be easy for others to understand".
- Lie, "and helps us all to continue to work together harmoniously".
These are words expected from an ERON's executive not from an open source dude. People are people, there is no such thing as free software, you are now paying the price.
4/4/2007 2:22:42 AM (Central Daylight Time, UTC-05:00)
John,

As a long time community member I am sad to hear about this!! I wondered what was up when I seen it in the news letter. I have been very busy this last year so I have been away from the community, so thought maybe you had other plans.

For some reason this does not surprise me. To say this nicely, Shaun Walker is a punk!!! I have never cared much for him. He has always seemed irresponsible, and the community fame only got to his head! I can recall a statement made by him some years ago now for the reason for a core team. I can now only say he's a liar, and them asking you to lie makes my belief a fact. I agree with Nick about the move from ASP.Net. The benefactor crap didn't help either. Things like this have helped move me away from the community, regardless of my busy life.

If it wasn't for giving people like us John, DNN probably would not have gotten where it is now. I am truly sad to see they have treated you this way after all you have given!! I hope the best for you as you deserve better then this.

Best Regards,
Dave
Dave
1/2/2008 9:06:52 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I only just read your blog on this matter. I have no idea of why you were removed from the core team however the wording of the email shows just how commercialised DNN is now becoming. I certainly hope that you did not surcome to their request. I must say that your posts have been a great help to me over the years.
The forums have changed over the years with less and less general discussion on DNN and more a list of errors - DNN is fast becoming more and more like the commercial product every day and now is suffering from the process.
I now first check the snapis forums before even venturing onto the slow dnn forums.
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